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TOPIC | anyone know about fish tanks? (Updated)
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I really want to start a smallish fish tank. My beta fish-fish is pretty happy in his bowl with his plant, but I really want a nice small tank. I want to put in at least one real plant and I would love to have a few other fish. I like mollys, swordtails, neons, and those little catfish. (I like aquarium frogs too, but that might be overkill.) I dont have to have everything on that list though.

So...

How do I choose a good tank?
What is the smallest size I can get away with and allow the fish an okay life?
What fish would work well with my beta?
What number of fish can I have in the tank?
What plants work well and do not grow like crazy?
Can I prune the plants when they get out of control?
My parents had a tank with an albino snail that actually hunted and ate fish... is this normal for snails?

Lots of silly questions, but I would love to have someone to talk to about getting started.

edit: I just subbed to this thread
I really want to start a smallish fish tank. My beta fish-fish is pretty happy in his bowl with his plant, but I really want a nice small tank. I want to put in at least one real plant and I would love to have a few other fish. I like mollys, swordtails, neons, and those little catfish. (I like aquarium frogs too, but that might be overkill.) I dont have to have everything on that list though.

So...

How do I choose a good tank?
What is the smallest size I can get away with and allow the fish an okay life?
What fish would work well with my beta?
What number of fish can I have in the tank?
What plants work well and do not grow like crazy?
Can I prune the plants when they get out of control?
My parents had a tank with an albino snail that actually hunted and ate fish... is this normal for snails?

Lots of silly questions, but I would love to have someone to talk to about getting started.

edit: I just subbed to this thread
@JaranMarcel
*stand up waving*

Oooooo me me! Majored in Animal Nutritional and Behavioral sciences specializing in birds, fish and reptiles. Whatcha got for me :D

Edit: just noticed your questions

Get the biggest you can afford and comfortably fit in your space. I'd recommend a minimum of 10 gallons. Anything smaller requires frequent water changes and can't hold a bacteria cycle very well

Rule of thumb for fish smaller than 6 inches. A gallon of water per inch of adult fish. So if you had a fish that grows 3 inches it needs at least 3 gallons. It's a bit of an outdated rule but still works for small fish.

Good easy plants are Java fern and Anubias Nana. Both of these plants you can tie to decorations. They get all of their nutrients from theach water column and their roots mostly just hold them in place. In fact if you bury them in soil, they'll rot!

Yep you can prune them back if they get out of control! :)

Edit 2: because I'm at work and had to stop typing

There is a species of snail called Assassin snail. They will eat other snails and sometimes fish. But no its not a common behavior.

If you want to get your Betta a tank mate, the minimum size gallons is 10. Betta are territorial so you want to give them lots of space to get away from each other. The more decorations/plants you have the easier it will be for the fish.

Good tank mates:
Neon tetra - schooling fish minimum 6
Cardinal tetra - schooling fish minimum 6
Snails
Smaller non fancy tailed fish are the best bet. Though remember to follow the inch per gallon rule. So you may end up needed a bigger tank than you realize at the start. But honestly, Betta are so territorial they really are fine without tank mates. In fact even if your Betta doesn't attack the other fish, sometimes the fish are so attracted to the Betta fins, they will fin nip and rip apart his fins. So tank mates can be done, but you've got to pick the appropriate size and make sure you stick with smaller fish generally.

Hope that helps! Inbox me with anything else! I love talking about this stuff!

@JaranMarcel
*stand up waving*

Oooooo me me! Majored in Animal Nutritional and Behavioral sciences specializing in birds, fish and reptiles. Whatcha got for me :D

Edit: just noticed your questions

Get the biggest you can afford and comfortably fit in your space. I'd recommend a minimum of 10 gallons. Anything smaller requires frequent water changes and can't hold a bacteria cycle very well

Rule of thumb for fish smaller than 6 inches. A gallon of water per inch of adult fish. So if you had a fish that grows 3 inches it needs at least 3 gallons. It's a bit of an outdated rule but still works for small fish.

Good easy plants are Java fern and Anubias Nana. Both of these plants you can tie to decorations. They get all of their nutrients from theach water column and their roots mostly just hold them in place. In fact if you bury them in soil, they'll rot!

Yep you can prune them back if they get out of control! :)

Edit 2: because I'm at work and had to stop typing

There is a species of snail called Assassin snail. They will eat other snails and sometimes fish. But no its not a common behavior.

If you want to get your Betta a tank mate, the minimum size gallons is 10. Betta are territorial so you want to give them lots of space to get away from each other. The more decorations/plants you have the easier it will be for the fish.

Good tank mates:
Neon tetra - schooling fish minimum 6
Cardinal tetra - schooling fish minimum 6
Snails
Smaller non fancy tailed fish are the best bet. Though remember to follow the inch per gallon rule. So you may end up needed a bigger tank than you realize at the start. But honestly, Betta are so territorial they really are fine without tank mates. In fact even if your Betta doesn't attack the other fish, sometimes the fish are so attracted to the Betta fins, they will fin nip and rip apart his fins. So tank mates can be done, but you've got to pick the appropriate size and make sure you stick with smaller fish generally.

Hope that helps! Inbox me with anything else! I love talking about this stuff!

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Me too! Okay, so yes ten gallons is a great way to go, but I have a betta in a 2.5 hats perfectly happy. If you can't get a ten gallon, 2.5 is te absolute minimum. Five gallons is a good compromise.
Make sure you have a filter and a heater.
You could get nerite snails if you're interested in snails! They stay small, they're efficient and they don't produce much waste. I'll come back and leave more tips soon :) I gotta do something productive.
Me too! Okay, so yes ten gallons is a great way to go, but I have a betta in a 2.5 hats perfectly happy. If you can't get a ten gallon, 2.5 is te absolute minimum. Five gallons is a good compromise.
Make sure you have a filter and a heater.
You could get nerite snails if you're interested in snails! They stay small, they're efficient and they don't produce much waste. I'll come back and leave more tips soon :) I gotta do something productive.
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@JaranMarcel

Bless the people on this site! It feels so good to see people say filters and heaters and bigger tanks for bettas.

I say 5 gallons is bare min, but I have my bettas in 10 gallons each. They'll appreciate the space if you have room.

Some bettas do better than others with tankmates. I personally say no to them, as they don't seek this out this company and do not get lonely, but they might manage if they have a good temperment. If you do choose tankmates, then 10 gallons will be too small for the minimum schooling size, keep that in mind. Stunting and crowding are real problems for fish.

I agree with most of what @CyrinaLuna said, but do know that the one inch of fish per gallon rule is outdated and causes problems. The example of a 3 inch fish in 3 gallons of water would be a painful existence and quick death. This rule does not take into account compatability, behavior, and bioload. Bioload is how much waste a fish creates and how it taxes their environment, and it differs by species. Bettas have a small bioload, while goldfish have a huge bioload.

The MOST important thing is to know the aquarium Nitrogen Cycle! Its essentially how waste is broken down in a closed system to make the water safe for your fish. Theres a lot of good resources online about this but if you get overwhemed or confused please just ping me! I can explain whatever you have questions about- it can be a little confusing at first :)
@JaranMarcel

Bless the people on this site! It feels so good to see people say filters and heaters and bigger tanks for bettas.

I say 5 gallons is bare min, but I have my bettas in 10 gallons each. They'll appreciate the space if you have room.

Some bettas do better than others with tankmates. I personally say no to them, as they don't seek this out this company and do not get lonely, but they might manage if they have a good temperment. If you do choose tankmates, then 10 gallons will be too small for the minimum schooling size, keep that in mind. Stunting and crowding are real problems for fish.

I agree with most of what @CyrinaLuna said, but do know that the one inch of fish per gallon rule is outdated and causes problems. The example of a 3 inch fish in 3 gallons of water would be a painful existence and quick death. This rule does not take into account compatability, behavior, and bioload. Bioload is how much waste a fish creates and how it taxes their environment, and it differs by species. Bettas have a small bioload, while goldfish have a huge bioload.

The MOST important thing is to know the aquarium Nitrogen Cycle! Its essentially how waste is broken down in a closed system to make the water safe for your fish. Theres a lot of good resources online about this but if you get overwhemed or confused please just ping me! I can explain whatever you have questions about- it can be a little confusing at first :)
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@cooneyms I agree the rule is outdated. I was gonna come back after work and flesh that out a bit. But I had to keep my responses short because I don't have much time for work. It's an okay (kind of) rule to start with but not for justifying 1 3 inch fish in a 3 gallon tank. I use it more for giving stocking guidelines. Say you have a 20 gallon. 5 3 inch fish (mollies and platies) would be good for that because it gives you room left over to take into account the bio load. Compatibility is a big issue when it comes to stocking. Which is why I recommend researching the fish you want before you even go to the store. There's so much I can go in depth with but like I said I'm short on time atm lol.

I agree on the Nitrogen Cycle! If you want to start a fish tanknot I recommend having a good understanding of it. I'll come back and break it down when I have more time.
@cooneyms I agree the rule is outdated. I was gonna come back after work and flesh that out a bit. But I had to keep my responses short because I don't have much time for work. It's an okay (kind of) rule to start with but not for justifying 1 3 inch fish in a 3 gallon tank. I use it more for giving stocking guidelines. Say you have a 20 gallon. 5 3 inch fish (mollies and platies) would be good for that because it gives you room left over to take into account the bio load. Compatibility is a big issue when it comes to stocking. Which is why I recommend researching the fish you want before you even go to the store. There's so much I can go in depth with but like I said I'm short on time atm lol.

I agree on the Nitrogen Cycle! If you want to start a fish tanknot I recommend having a good understanding of it. I'll come back and break it down when I have more time.
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@CyrinaLuna @mPhish

I was thinking about a five or a six gallon with my betta and maybe 2-4 fish depending on size of the fish and some plants. I do not know if this is possible though. Fish-fish's bowl is a bit small, though he has been living in there for a year and a half and is very healthy and social. I like watching fish and having a little bit of life in my room.

Story time!
My parents had a pretty big tank for a long time, (I was probably 3-12 during the time that we had a tank) but my mother is not very good at taking care of fish. The tank had many die offs and algae blooms. We had a female betta that ate the male because we did not know that they would fight. There was also a white snail that would make slime platforms and dive off it, attaching to the fish he caught and pinning them to the bottom of the tank while he ate them. We also had an explosion of snails from a different batch when one of them decided to give birth. (I do not like snails that eat fish)

On the other hand, during the times when the tank was healthy, we had a large array of mollys, swordtails, neons, zebra danios, and a little catfish that lived for nine years. My mother's betas lived for under a year each, but my baby beta fish that my mother did not want, lived for three years. She was just over the size of a pencil lead when I bought her at walmart in her tiny cup =) Anyway, the swordtails would not stop breeding and we ended up giving away tons of them. We also had a problem with aquarium plants that would not stop growing. Eventually there was a die-off big enough that my mother gave away all the fish and that was the end of them.

Back to the subject at hand

I do not want to cause a huge die off, but I do want just a small tank that I can keep in my room with a couple fish and some plants to start me off. Since I was so young when we had the tank, I never really learned about how to care for it. I do not mind maintaining things, so I thought having a plant or too could be fun.

Do you guys have any recommendation on tank set ups. I really do no nothing about them. =/
@CyrinaLuna @mPhish

I was thinking about a five or a six gallon with my betta and maybe 2-4 fish depending on size of the fish and some plants. I do not know if this is possible though. Fish-fish's bowl is a bit small, though he has been living in there for a year and a half and is very healthy and social. I like watching fish and having a little bit of life in my room.

Story time!
My parents had a pretty big tank for a long time, (I was probably 3-12 during the time that we had a tank) but my mother is not very good at taking care of fish. The tank had many die offs and algae blooms. We had a female betta that ate the male because we did not know that they would fight. There was also a white snail that would make slime platforms and dive off it, attaching to the fish he caught and pinning them to the bottom of the tank while he ate them. We also had an explosion of snails from a different batch when one of them decided to give birth. (I do not like snails that eat fish)

On the other hand, during the times when the tank was healthy, we had a large array of mollys, swordtails, neons, zebra danios, and a little catfish that lived for nine years. My mother's betas lived for under a year each, but my baby beta fish that my mother did not want, lived for three years. She was just over the size of a pencil lead when I bought her at walmart in her tiny cup =) Anyway, the swordtails would not stop breeding and we ended up giving away tons of them. We also had a problem with aquarium plants that would not stop growing. Eventually there was a die-off big enough that my mother gave away all the fish and that was the end of them.

Back to the subject at hand

I do not want to cause a huge die off, but I do want just a small tank that I can keep in my room with a couple fish and some plants to start me off. Since I was so young when we had the tank, I never really learned about how to care for it. I do not mind maintaining things, so I thought having a plant or too could be fun.

Do you guys have any recommendation on tank set ups. I really do no nothing about them. =/
If the largest size you can afford is a ten gallon I would absolutely not keep your betta with any tankmates besides a few ramshorn or nerite snails. Anubias, java fern, and wisteria are very easy plants to grow with most light setups and water parameters.

The inch per gallon rule is garbage and shouldn't make any impact on the fish you keep in certain sized tanks. Always research the actual environment these fish are from and the natural behaviors they NEED to be able to express in their captive environment. For example, neon tetras should not be kept in ten gallon tanks although they theoretically could work if following the inch per gallon rule. Neon tetras are schooling fish that do best in numbers of 10+. Keeping them in a ten gallon tank would not give these fish enough room to swim or school properly. They are also fairly sensitive to water parameter changes and depending on where you get them from can be very poorly bred and weak as well. They do much better in larger (but still small, we're talking like a 20-30g tank). These fish deserve as much attention given to their natural behaviors and needs as any other fish.

If you have any questions feel free. I'm a former aquarist and have over a decade in the hobby keeping and breeding freshwater, brackish, and saltwater fish and inverts.
If the largest size you can afford is a ten gallon I would absolutely not keep your betta with any tankmates besides a few ramshorn or nerite snails. Anubias, java fern, and wisteria are very easy plants to grow with most light setups and water parameters.

The inch per gallon rule is garbage and shouldn't make any impact on the fish you keep in certain sized tanks. Always research the actual environment these fish are from and the natural behaviors they NEED to be able to express in their captive environment. For example, neon tetras should not be kept in ten gallon tanks although they theoretically could work if following the inch per gallon rule. Neon tetras are schooling fish that do best in numbers of 10+. Keeping them in a ten gallon tank would not give these fish enough room to swim or school properly. They are also fairly sensitive to water parameter changes and depending on where you get them from can be very poorly bred and weak as well. They do much better in larger (but still small, we're talking like a 20-30g tank). These fish deserve as much attention given to their natural behaviors and needs as any other fish.

If you have any questions feel free. I'm a former aquarist and have over a decade in the hobby keeping and breeding freshwater, brackish, and saltwater fish and inverts.
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@CyrinaLuna

No worries! I can tell you know your stuff. I just didn't want the OP to get confused with any details. It can be hard to give aquarium advise in a quick way. I'm also slacking work for fish talk XD


@JaranMarcel

Nice! If you go with a 5 or 6 gallon, then just the betta would be best, no tank mates. He or she will use all that space themselves and company in close quarters will cause stress.

It sounds like your mother's tank had a lot of issues with water chemistry due to too many fish in the tank, and with fish being incompatable with one another. Algae blooms are unsightly, but not necissarily a bad thing. If algae growth gets out of control, it's usually because of excess light and/or excess Nitrates that they feed on. You'll learn about Nitrates when you read about the Nitrogen Cycle.

Essentially, always think of what your fish needs first. Research as much as you can. Fish tanks require more attention than some other pets because of the water chemistry but its so rewarding. A good environment is a happy fish, and happy fish make owners happy :)

For tank set ups, I like Aqueon brand a lot. You can get a 5 gallon tank at Petco for about $15, and a cover for it for less. Bettas with long fins need low water flow in their filtera. I use Tetra 10i in my 10 gallons, and I block the flow with some plastic. A smaller one might be better for 5 gallons. Aqueon makes good heaters too. The temp should be vare min 78 degrees for bettas. They are tropical and get lethargic when they're cold. 80 degrees is even more ideal.


@slothbug
Agreed!
@CyrinaLuna

No worries! I can tell you know your stuff. I just didn't want the OP to get confused with any details. It can be hard to give aquarium advise in a quick way. I'm also slacking work for fish talk XD


@JaranMarcel

Nice! If you go with a 5 or 6 gallon, then just the betta would be best, no tank mates. He or she will use all that space themselves and company in close quarters will cause stress.

It sounds like your mother's tank had a lot of issues with water chemistry due to too many fish in the tank, and with fish being incompatable with one another. Algae blooms are unsightly, but not necissarily a bad thing. If algae growth gets out of control, it's usually because of excess light and/or excess Nitrates that they feed on. You'll learn about Nitrates when you read about the Nitrogen Cycle.

Essentially, always think of what your fish needs first. Research as much as you can. Fish tanks require more attention than some other pets because of the water chemistry but its so rewarding. A good environment is a happy fish, and happy fish make owners happy :)

For tank set ups, I like Aqueon brand a lot. You can get a 5 gallon tank at Petco for about $15, and a cover for it for less. Bettas with long fins need low water flow in their filtera. I use Tetra 10i in my 10 gallons, and I block the flow with some plastic. A smaller one might be better for 5 gallons. Aqueon makes good heaters too. The temp should be vare min 78 degrees for bettas. They are tropical and get lethargic when they're cold. 80 degrees is even more ideal.


@slothbug
Agreed!
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@slothbug
okay, no neons, I am okay with that. They were always the most fragile in the tank anyway. I dont think I like ramshorn, snails.... The clear ones look like the kind that ate all the swordtails in my mother's tank. Nerite snails are kind of cute though.

Can I keep one of those little catfish in the tank with him? I know they have non-albino versions of them. I am afraid that I do not know what they are called, or I would look it up myself. We only had one, but he lived for nine years. He was only an inch long and never seemed to grow though, so maybe that was a bad sign? And yes, it was the same fish because my mother never hid fish dying from my sister and I.

I really kind of want to learn about aquarium fish types.
@slothbug
okay, no neons, I am okay with that. They were always the most fragile in the tank anyway. I dont think I like ramshorn, snails.... The clear ones look like the kind that ate all the swordtails in my mother's tank. Nerite snails are kind of cute though.

Can I keep one of those little catfish in the tank with him? I know they have non-albino versions of them. I am afraid that I do not know what they are called, or I would look it up myself. We only had one, but he lived for nine years. He was only an inch long and never seemed to grow though, so maybe that was a bad sign? And yes, it was the same fish because my mother never hid fish dying from my sister and I.

I really kind of want to learn about aquarium fish types.
@cooneyms thanks! Collaboration is important in fish keeping. It's all about the betterment of our aquatic friends :D

@JaranMarcel if you can only go with a 5 or 6 gallon. I would just keep your betta. You might be able to pull off 1-2 nerite snails with him. They don't breed in freshwater and they don't eat other fish. So no worries there. But honestly I would just stick with the Betta for a tank under 10 gallons.

The catfish seems like an albino Cory cat. They're schooling and get a decent sized so I wouldn't recommend them for any smaller than a 20-30 gallon. They are neat fish though!

A quick and simple breakdown of the Nitrogen Cycle
Anything that goes into the tank (uneaten food, decaying plants, poop, dead fish etc) all decay into ammonia. There's a beneficial bacteria that lives in your filter. The two types of bacteria break the ammonia down into nitrites and then nitrates. Nitrates are removed from the tank a little bit by plants as fertilizer, but mostly by manual water changes. Establishing a bacteria colony means that any ammonia in the tank gets quickly broken down through the cycle into the final form of nitrates.

Weekly water changes 10-30% depending on stocking and tank size are necessary to keep the nitrate levels under control.

There are a few ways to kick start the Nitrogen Cycle in your tank.
1- get some filter media from an already established tank. Preferably from someone who is well informed on the hobby. That way you're given an already established bacteria colony. However (and this goes with all of these options) you're going to want to get your water tested to monitor your ammonia/nitrite/nitrate levels. They're going to fluctuate when you first start a tank. Most local fish stores (try to go to a non chain one - worked at petsmart for a while and let me tell you most people don't know how to help you) will test your water for you if you bring in a sample

2 - fish less cycle. I really wouldn't try this unless you have your own liquid test kit and can monitor the levels at least 3x daily. Basically with this one you dose the water with pure ammonia (no fish in the tank) to grow the bacteria colony from scratch.

3- fish-in cycle this is what most beginners do. Cycling the tank with a fish already in it. Short version - bacteria will start to grow off of the ammonia produced by the food and fish waste. Downside to this is daily water changes and monitoring of your ammonia/nitrites/nitrates. And it is incredibly stressful for the fish.

Of course no matter what I recommend testing your water ammonia/nitrites/nitrates at minimum 3x weekly (may be a bit overkill but it won't hurt).

Because the bacteria lives mostly in your filter (there is some in the water column and more on the gravel, but the vast majority of it is in your filter) you do not want to change your filter cartridge. You can rinse it in fish safe water if it gets too gross, but down ever straight throw it out. Or you'll have to start your cycle all over again.

Hopefully some own else can chime in with more.
@cooneyms thanks! Collaboration is important in fish keeping. It's all about the betterment of our aquatic friends :D

@JaranMarcel if you can only go with a 5 or 6 gallon. I would just keep your betta. You might be able to pull off 1-2 nerite snails with him. They don't breed in freshwater and they don't eat other fish. So no worries there. But honestly I would just stick with the Betta for a tank under 10 gallons.

The catfish seems like an albino Cory cat. They're schooling and get a decent sized so I wouldn't recommend them for any smaller than a 20-30 gallon. They are neat fish though!

A quick and simple breakdown of the Nitrogen Cycle
Anything that goes into the tank (uneaten food, decaying plants, poop, dead fish etc) all decay into ammonia. There's a beneficial bacteria that lives in your filter. The two types of bacteria break the ammonia down into nitrites and then nitrates. Nitrates are removed from the tank a little bit by plants as fertilizer, but mostly by manual water changes. Establishing a bacteria colony means that any ammonia in the tank gets quickly broken down through the cycle into the final form of nitrates.

Weekly water changes 10-30% depending on stocking and tank size are necessary to keep the nitrate levels under control.

There are a few ways to kick start the Nitrogen Cycle in your tank.
1- get some filter media from an already established tank. Preferably from someone who is well informed on the hobby. That way you're given an already established bacteria colony. However (and this goes with all of these options) you're going to want to get your water tested to monitor your ammonia/nitrite/nitrate levels. They're going to fluctuate when you first start a tank. Most local fish stores (try to go to a non chain one - worked at petsmart for a while and let me tell you most people don't know how to help you) will test your water for you if you bring in a sample

2 - fish less cycle. I really wouldn't try this unless you have your own liquid test kit and can monitor the levels at least 3x daily. Basically with this one you dose the water with pure ammonia (no fish in the tank) to grow the bacteria colony from scratch.

3- fish-in cycle this is what most beginners do. Cycling the tank with a fish already in it. Short version - bacteria will start to grow off of the ammonia produced by the food and fish waste. Downside to this is daily water changes and monitoring of your ammonia/nitrites/nitrates. And it is incredibly stressful for the fish.

Of course no matter what I recommend testing your water ammonia/nitrites/nitrates at minimum 3x weekly (may be a bit overkill but it won't hurt).

Because the bacteria lives mostly in your filter (there is some in the water column and more on the gravel, but the vast majority of it is in your filter) you do not want to change your filter cartridge. You can rinse it in fish safe water if it gets too gross, but down ever straight throw it out. Or you'll have to start your cycle all over again.

Hopefully some own else can chime in with more.
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