exactly what the title says. there should be at least one beastclan npc to go along with all the others, either as a trading post npc or a joxar-like function or something similar but preferably something that would get them their own page and official art. dragons are far from sornieth's only sapient race, after all, and it's been shown at the very least through the familiars system that dragons and beastfolk coexisting on friendly terms is far from impossible and may even happen much more often than the leadership of either major player in the war would like to think.
i don't have any ideas for what the npc's function could be since the important part is just them being a member of a beastclan race, so feel free to suggest some. i might quote a few if i really like them.
exactly what the title says. there should be at least one beastclan npc to go along with all the others, either as a trading post npc or a joxar-like function or something similar but preferably something that would get them their own page and official art. dragons are far from sornieth's only sapient race, after all, and it's been shown at the very least through the familiars system that dragons and beastfolk coexisting on friendly terms is far from impossible and may even happen much more often than the leadership of either major player in the war would like to think.
i don't have any ideas for what the npc's function could be since the important part is just them being a member of a beastclan race, so feel free to suggest some. i might quote a few if i really like them.
hey!!! what if!!! they give you coli quests like!!! kill (amount) of (coli meanies) to get (prize) or something like that
idk what kind of prize wouldnt break the economy tho
hey!!! what if!!! they give you coli quests like!!! kill (amount) of (coli meanies) to get (prize) or something like that
idk what kind of prize wouldnt break the economy tho
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banii
tbh any new addition to any part of the site for any reason is bound to break the economy at least a little bit so i wouldn't worry about it too much unless the consequences would be game-breakingly catastrophic or it's something insultingly unnecessary like breeding-exclusive eyes or clanbound pvp rewards. i mean even something as simple as new apparel tends to mess things up for a little while.
i think more than likely a coli quest npc would be functionally a lot like fiona, with the bonding level quests that give out special familiars, so it's economic impact would probably be similar. a bigger problem i think might be how to include people who can't coli in the special quest item-having fun.
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banii
tbh any new addition to any part of the site for any reason is bound to break the economy at least a little bit so i wouldn't worry about it too much unless the consequences would be game-breakingly catastrophic or it's something insultingly unnecessary like breeding-exclusive eyes or clanbound pvp rewards. i mean even something as simple as new apparel tends to mess things up for a little while.
i think more than likely a coli quest npc would be functionally a lot like fiona, with the bonding level quests that give out special familiars, so it's economic impact would probably be similar. a bigger problem i think might be how to include people who can't coli in the special quest item-having fun.
According to site lore the beastclans are kinda like second-class citizens (and sometimes are openly hostile enemies) to dragonkind so a beastclan NPC would be a little awkward to include. It wouldn't be impossible (after all we do canonically have beastclan representatives) but it would be a little strange for dragons to follow the orders of or help a beastclan NPC who was asking for help or providing a service.
I know not everyone cares about lore but the dev team have done a really good job at keep things consistent when it comes to the site lore and I want them to continue this going forward.
To be clear, I'm not against this but the NPC would need to have a good explanation for why they are offering the services they are offering to dragonkind.
According to site lore the beastclans are kinda like second-class citizens (and sometimes are openly hostile enemies) to dragonkind so a beastclan NPC would be a little awkward to include. It wouldn't be impossible (after all we do canonically have beastclan representatives) but it would be a little strange for dragons to follow the orders of or help a beastclan NPC who was asking for help or providing a service.
I know not everyone cares about lore but the dev team have done a really good job at keep things consistent when it comes to the site lore and I want them to continue this going forward.
To be clear, I'm not against this but the NPC would need to have a good explanation for why they are offering the services they are offering to dragonkind.
[quote name="CrazyRedFire" date="2020-03-28 13:09:27" ]
According to site lore the beastclans are kinda like second-class citizens (and sometimes are openly hostile enemies) to dragonkind so a beastclan NPC would be a little awkward to include. It wouldn't be impossible (after all we do canonically have beastclan representatives) but it would be a little strange for dragons to follow the orders of or help a beastclan NPC who was asking for help or providing a service.
I know not everyone cares about lore but the dev team have done a really good job at keep things consistent when it comes to the site lore and I want them to continue this going forward.
To be clear, I'm not against this but the NPC would need to have a good explanation for why they are offering the services they are offering to dragonkind.
[/quote]
I doubt a quest type beast clan NPC would be a good idea, because of what is quoted and because a beastclan sending dragons out to kill other beastclans? While nice for player lore, I don't think that is a direction the game wants to go :D
However, instead, what about a beastclan that is offering 'wares' from beastclans. IE, players have been asking for certain beastclan stuff to become wearable, so this beastclan would offer those. My only concern would be making the NPC different from Swipp or Baldwin.
CrazyRedFire wrote on 2020-03-28 13:09:27:
According to site lore the beastclans are kinda like second-class citizens (and sometimes are openly hostile enemies) to dragonkind so a beastclan NPC would be a little awkward to include. It wouldn't be impossible (after all we do canonically have beastclan representatives) but it would be a little strange for dragons to follow the orders of or help a beastclan NPC who was asking for help or providing a service.
I know not everyone cares about lore but the dev team have done a really good job at keep things consistent when it comes to the site lore and I want them to continue this going forward.
To be clear, I'm not against this but the NPC would need to have a good explanation for why they are offering the services they are offering to dragonkind.
I doubt a quest type beast clan NPC would be a good idea, because of what is quoted and because a beastclan sending dragons out to kill other beastclans? While nice for player lore, I don't think that is a direction the game wants to go :D
However, instead, what about a beastclan that is offering 'wares' from beastclans. IE, players have been asking for certain beastclan stuff to become wearable, so this beastclan would offer those. My only concern would be making the NPC different from Swipp or Baldwin.
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Jemadar
i certainly would be interested in seeing a way to get some of those on-apparel clothes items made into the apparel they rightfully deserve to be. maybe they could be a tailor? since the lore reason for a lot of those items not being real apparel is that they're not fitted to dragon proportions.
don't have any ideas how it could possibly be made different enough from baldwin/swipp though. i think maybe if those items were made into apparel it would be better for them to be obtainable in existing ways rather than adding a whole new feature unfortunately.
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Jemadar
i certainly would be interested in seeing a way to get some of those on-apparel clothes items made into the apparel they rightfully deserve to be. maybe they could be a tailor? since the lore reason for a lot of those items not being real apparel is that they're not fitted to dragon proportions.
don't have any ideas how it could possibly be made different enough from baldwin/swipp though. i think maybe if those items were made into apparel it would be better for them to be obtainable in existing ways rather than adding a whole new feature unfortunately.
[quote name="Ragnarok42" date="2020-03-29 11:07:48" ]
Jemadar
i certainly would be interested in seeing a way to get some of those on-apparel clothes items made into the apparel they rightfully deserve to be. maybe they could be a tailor? since the lore reason for a lot of those items not being real apparel is that they're not fitted to dragon proportions.
don't have any ideas how it could possibly be made different enough from baldwin/swipp though. i think maybe if those items were made into apparel it would be better for them to be obtainable in existing ways rather than adding a whole new feature unfortunately.
[/quote]
That is my thought, that was just one of the few ways I could see a beastclan NPC really working, since canonically most of the beastclans are at war with the dragon clans, so I really can't see a beastclan member just hanging out with dragons.
If it is just a beastclan NPC, and not a trading post NPC, then I could see them adding beastclan members to the various stories, since there are a couple of clans that are friendly towards dragons. But Trading post NPC? that would be a tough one to add realistically.
Ragnarok42 wrote on 2020-03-29 11:07:48:
Jemadar
i certainly would be interested in seeing a way to get some of those on-apparel clothes items made into the apparel they rightfully deserve to be. maybe they could be a tailor? since the lore reason for a lot of those items not being real apparel is that they're not fitted to dragon proportions.
don't have any ideas how it could possibly be made different enough from baldwin/swipp though. i think maybe if those items were made into apparel it would be better for them to be obtainable in existing ways rather than adding a whole new feature unfortunately.
That is my thought, that was just one of the few ways I could see a beastclan NPC really working, since canonically most of the beastclans are at war with the dragon clans, so I really can't see a beastclan member just hanging out with dragons.
If it is just a beastclan NPC, and not a trading post NPC, then I could see them adding beastclan members to the various stories, since there are a couple of clans that are friendly towards dragons. But Trading post NPC? that would be a tough one to add realistically.
If we were to get one, logically it would be a Dunhoof Centaur since lore-wise, they have been the ally of dragons.
If we were to get one, logically it would be a Dunhoof Centaur since lore-wise, they have been the ally of dragons.
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If writers are supposed to "show not tell," why are we called "storytellers" and not "storyshow-ers"?
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Jemadar
canonically the dunhoof centaur clan is friendly to dragons, so i guess if realism is a huge concern a hypothetical trading post npc could be one of them.
personally i don't think justifying them being there is that big of a deal (i could just as easily ask where galore and swipp are getting all their stuff, or what swipp is doing with exactly 170 live sparrows and why you hand him exactly 170 live sparrows just so he can hand one back to you except somehow it's a pet now, or where crim is getting the money to buy so much junk when all she does is stand there, or why joxar isn't part of the trading post when he functionally is a trader, or why the trading post itself and/or it's residents haven't been attacked yet either by beastclans or element-racists or any of the surrounding conquesting flights since a lot of different element dragons coexist constantly there and it seems like it would be of some strategic value and appears to be undefended) but i don't think it would be the hardest thing in the world to handwave either.
the trading post lore already seems to imply that it's a lot bigger than what we see and is something of a hub for caravans of all kinds to go through, so if anywhere was going to have a handful of beastclan shopkeepers trying to mingle (successful mingling optional) it would be there. and owning a shop doesn't necessarily mean it does well or people treat you with respect, after all.
of course, a trading post-style function preforming npc wouldn't necessarily have to be attached to the trading post either, since we've still got joxar running around selling magical halos and live bears for handfuls of leaves (what does he do with them. joxar. what do you do with the leaves.)
@
Jemadar
canonically the dunhoof centaur clan is friendly to dragons, so i guess if realism is a huge concern a hypothetical trading post npc could be one of them.
personally i don't think justifying them being there is that big of a deal (i could just as easily ask where galore and swipp are getting all their stuff, or what swipp is doing with exactly 170 live sparrows and why you hand him exactly 170 live sparrows just so he can hand one back to you except somehow it's a pet now, or where crim is getting the money to buy so much junk when all she does is stand there, or why joxar isn't part of the trading post when he functionally is a trader, or why the trading post itself and/or it's residents haven't been attacked yet either by beastclans or element-racists or any of the surrounding conquesting flights since a lot of different element dragons coexist constantly there and it seems like it would be of some strategic value and appears to be undefended) but i don't think it would be the hardest thing in the world to handwave either.
the trading post lore already seems to imply that it's a lot bigger than what we see and is something of a hub for caravans of all kinds to go through, so if anywhere was going to have a handful of beastclan shopkeepers trying to mingle (successful mingling optional) it would be there. and owning a shop doesn't necessarily mean it does well or people treat you with respect, after all.
of course, a trading post-style function preforming npc wouldn't necessarily have to be attached to the trading post either, since we've still got joxar running around selling magical halos and live bears for handfuls of leaves (what does he do with them. joxar. what do you do with the leaves.)
The thing is, those do make sense.
Swipp is a trader, so he is making trades all the time. Perhaps he needs those 170 sparrows to find one that is tameable. It just takes that many. Galore could be a very rich guardian that has been hoarding for centuries and has now decided to share his riches with players. Most of it is just left up to the player to decide. Swipp may be making trades with the beastclans, so he takes the items we give him to the beastclans. That is why he needs that many, because that is how many the beastclans have decided is worth whatever they are giving swipp. There are many reasons that could be there.
I think Joxar isn't part of the trading post because he is only part time, he isn't open all the time, so it would probably confuse a lot of players at first when they tried to go to him and couldn't because he is only open on festival weeks. Plus, it is a much simpler thing for users to click on a side bar link than have to navigate the trading post to find him during festival weeks.
As for the other, while the deities are technically at war, I get the feeling it is more of a 'cold war' than all out warfare. So, clans of different elements do and can coexist, and the trading post NPCs might be ones who are sick of it, or care more for the services they provide.
since we don't know where the trading post exists in the world, we also don't know how well defended it is. For all we know it is in the midst of a huge number of dragon clans, so no beastclans can get close enough to it to attack. It may be far enough out that no dragons want the land, and no beastclans live there. It may be that each NPC there has their own guards and makes sure that the trading post is safe.
Personally I would rather not have a beastclan NPC if it were seen as being mistreated or just barely tolerated, and would rather have one that has a function that makes sense for its personality and for it being there.
As with all the other 'lets have an X NPC!' type threads, I would rather have functionality over checklists. If the only reason to stick this dunhoof centaur in the trading post is to have a beast clan NPC, then I would rather skip it. If there is a good reason for this NPC to show up, then sure, I would love one, but I prefer functionality and trying to fit in with lore (or not outright going against it), as much as possible.
Most of the things commonly seen as going against lore (mainly the AH) don't actually go against lore as exist outside of it. IE, in lore there is no such thing as an auction house for dragons. This gives players the ability to create their own lore for it, and it makes the site seem more cohesive because we don't have this 'The site has X lore, but this mechanic is going to completely rip that to shreds and we will just ignore it' type situation that I have seen in other games/stories.
I think one of the things I fear/don't want is for FR's NPCs to become flat and one dimensional. We don't know a lot about the NPCs, but what we do know makes them seem more alive. I have seen too many games (not just petsites) where the NPCs are just blah. They are caricatures of characters, or they are all the same, or just all blend together without really making an impact. I don't want that, so I want the NPCs to have a reason for existing, beyond a check list of 'we want a Ridgeback NPC, we want a beastclan NPC, we want an X NPC' and so on.
That is why function is important to me, because the function helps round out the NPC. Fiona wouldn't be Fiona without her menagerie. Galore wouldn't be Galore without giving his gifts. If the function is something that is just slapped together in order to be able to fulfill one of the checklists, it will show.
The thing is, those do make sense.
Swipp is a trader, so he is making trades all the time. Perhaps he needs those 170 sparrows to find one that is tameable. It just takes that many. Galore could be a very rich guardian that has been hoarding for centuries and has now decided to share his riches with players. Most of it is just left up to the player to decide. Swipp may be making trades with the beastclans, so he takes the items we give him to the beastclans. That is why he needs that many, because that is how many the beastclans have decided is worth whatever they are giving swipp. There are many reasons that could be there.
I think Joxar isn't part of the trading post because he is only part time, he isn't open all the time, so it would probably confuse a lot of players at first when they tried to go to him and couldn't because he is only open on festival weeks. Plus, it is a much simpler thing for users to click on a side bar link than have to navigate the trading post to find him during festival weeks.
As for the other, while the deities are technically at war, I get the feeling it is more of a 'cold war' than all out warfare. So, clans of different elements do and can coexist, and the trading post NPCs might be ones who are sick of it, or care more for the services they provide.
since we don't know where the trading post exists in the world, we also don't know how well defended it is. For all we know it is in the midst of a huge number of dragon clans, so no beastclans can get close enough to it to attack. It may be far enough out that no dragons want the land, and no beastclans live there. It may be that each NPC there has their own guards and makes sure that the trading post is safe.
Personally I would rather not have a beastclan NPC if it were seen as being mistreated or just barely tolerated, and would rather have one that has a function that makes sense for its personality and for it being there.
As with all the other 'lets have an X NPC!' type threads, I would rather have functionality over checklists. If the only reason to stick this dunhoof centaur in the trading post is to have a beast clan NPC, then I would rather skip it. If there is a good reason for this NPC to show up, then sure, I would love one, but I prefer functionality and trying to fit in with lore (or not outright going against it), as much as possible.
Most of the things commonly seen as going against lore (mainly the AH) don't actually go against lore as exist outside of it. IE, in lore there is no such thing as an auction house for dragons. This gives players the ability to create their own lore for it, and it makes the site seem more cohesive because we don't have this 'The site has X lore, but this mechanic is going to completely rip that to shreds and we will just ignore it' type situation that I have seen in other games/stories.
I think one of the things I fear/don't want is for FR's NPCs to become flat and one dimensional. We don't know a lot about the NPCs, but what we do know makes them seem more alive. I have seen too many games (not just petsites) where the NPCs are just blah. They are caricatures of characters, or they are all the same, or just all blend together without really making an impact. I don't want that, so I want the NPCs to have a reason for existing, beyond a check list of 'we want a Ridgeback NPC, we want a beastclan NPC, we want an X NPC' and so on.
That is why function is important to me, because the function helps round out the NPC. Fiona wouldn't be Fiona without her menagerie. Galore wouldn't be Galore without giving his gifts. If the function is something that is just slapped together in order to be able to fulfill one of the checklists, it will show.