The market of dragons is nearly dead. It is almost impossible to get back the investment to new genes by selling the offspring. A potential solution would be to make old dragons less fertile or even infertile. The cooling times could get longer when a dragon gets older, and a real old dragon could be totally or nearly infertile. Then there could be an expensive item that allows a player to breed an old dragon once. That would create a market for young, fertile, dragons.
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TOPIC | solution to the dead market
The market of dragons is nearly dead. It is almost impossible to get back the investment to new genes by selling the offspring. A potential solution would be to make old dragons less fertile or even infertile. The cooling times could get longer when a dragon gets older, and a real old dragon could be totally or nearly infertile. Then there could be an expensive item that allows a player to breed an old dragon once. That would create a market for young, fertile, dragons.
Is it written or promised somewhere that selling offspring of new-gened dragons will give back you your investment? As far as I know, no, therefore this suggestion hinges on a personal assumption on what should be profitable. No support.
I am not sure why but this sentence is extremely creepy:
[quote name="Rhonu" date="2020-07-12 07:17:27" ]
That would create a market for young, fertile, dragons.
[/quote]
Is it written or promised somewhere that selling offspring of new-gened dragons will give back you your investment? As far as I know, no, therefore this suggestion hinges on a personal assumption on what should be profitable. No support.
I am not sure why but this sentence is extremely creepy:
I am not sure why but this sentence is extremely creepy:
Rhonu wrote on 2020-07-12 07:17:27:
That would create a market for young, fertile, dragons.
There is nothing wrong with the dragon market. Yes dragons may not sell for much but that is to be expected as dragon's weren't designed to be expensive as they do not have to be replaced and can breed indefinitely. It is far too late in the game to introduce infertility and forcing players to pay to be able to breed their favorite dragons just because they are older would be rubbing salt in the wounds.
Many players have approached this game differently from games where the pets have a life span or useful span--for example I would never spend money on art for my pets that would eventually die or become useless, but several of my dragons art. I also wouldn't have spend time and money on gen one dragon projects if they'd have to be replaced (yes I breed most of my gen one dragons).
Yes you may not be able to get back the money you invested in genes, but once a gene is established, genes scrolls are a luxury item and there's nothing wrong with that.
Edit: It is possible to make money breeding dragons, but it generally requires being proactive marketing the dragons or jumping on trends early on or finding the right buyer
Many players have approached this game differently from games where the pets have a life span or useful span--for example I would never spend money on art for my pets that would eventually die or become useless, but several of my dragons art. I also wouldn't have spend time and money on gen one dragon projects if they'd have to be replaced (yes I breed most of my gen one dragons).
Yes you may not be able to get back the money you invested in genes, but once a gene is established, genes scrolls are a luxury item and there's nothing wrong with that.
Edit: It is possible to make money breeding dragons, but it generally requires being proactive marketing the dragons or jumping on trends early on or finding the right buyer
There is nothing wrong with the dragon market. Yes dragons may not sell for much but that is to be expected as dragon's weren't designed to be expensive as they do not have to be replaced and can breed indefinitely. It is far too late in the game to introduce infertility and forcing players to pay to be able to breed their favorite dragons just because they are older would be rubbing salt in the wounds.
Many players have approached this game differently from games where the pets have a life span or useful span--for example I would never spend money on art for my pets that would eventually die or become useless, but several of my dragons art. I also wouldn't have spend time and money on gen one dragon projects if they'd have to be replaced (yes I breed most of my gen one dragons).
Yes you may not be able to get back the money you invested in genes, but once a gene is established, genes scrolls are a luxury item and there's nothing wrong with that.
Edit: It is possible to make money breeding dragons, but it generally requires being proactive marketing the dragons or jumping on trends early on or finding the right buyer
Many players have approached this game differently from games where the pets have a life span or useful span--for example I would never spend money on art for my pets that would eventually die or become useless, but several of my dragons art. I also wouldn't have spend time and money on gen one dragon projects if they'd have to be replaced (yes I breed most of my gen one dragons).
Yes you may not be able to get back the money you invested in genes, but once a gene is established, genes scrolls are a luxury item and there's nothing wrong with that.
Edit: It is possible to make money breeding dragons, but it generally requires being proactive marketing the dragons or jumping on trends early on or finding the right buyer
How would fertility actually work as a breeding mechanic though? Fertility on Lioden works because breeding attempts cost energy and lower fertility lions usually require more attempts. That doesn't exist here. Breeding is always successful on the first try. Would it mean less eggs per nest?
Personally, this would be a nightmare for players like me who prefer to breed our dragons, which can take months or years as it is. It'd be even more difficult if my dragons became less fertile over time, even if that means less eggs.
It may create a market for young dragons but old dragons will be near worthless for breeding, so that side of the market will crash.
I just see this as beneficial for those who want to apply new genes and sell at a profit. For breeders, it would cause much frustration
Edit: I see you mention cooldowns getting longer, which I missed. This is still frustrating for breeders. My Coatl and WC projects are already time consuming with their month-long cooldown. I can't imagine having to wait longer to breed my pairs.
Personally, this would be a nightmare for players like me who prefer to breed our dragons, which can take months or years as it is. It'd be even more difficult if my dragons became less fertile over time, even if that means less eggs.
It may create a market for young dragons but old dragons will be near worthless for breeding, so that side of the market will crash.
I just see this as beneficial for those who want to apply new genes and sell at a profit. For breeders, it would cause much frustration
Edit: I see you mention cooldowns getting longer, which I missed. This is still frustrating for breeders. My Coatl and WC projects are already time consuming with their month-long cooldown. I can't imagine having to wait longer to breed my pairs.
How would fertility actually work as a breeding mechanic though? Fertility on Lioden works because breeding attempts cost energy and lower fertility lions usually require more attempts. That doesn't exist here. Breeding is always successful on the first try. Would it mean less eggs per nest?
Personally, this would be a nightmare for players like me who prefer to breed our dragons, which can take months or years as it is. It'd be even more difficult if my dragons became less fertile over time, even if that means less eggs.
It may create a market for young dragons but old dragons will be near worthless for breeding, so that side of the market will crash.
I just see this as beneficial for those who want to apply new genes and sell at a profit. For breeders, it would cause much frustration
Edit: I see you mention cooldowns getting longer, which I missed. This is still frustrating for breeders. My Coatl and WC projects are already time consuming with their month-long cooldown. I can't imagine having to wait longer to breed my pairs.
Personally, this would be a nightmare for players like me who prefer to breed our dragons, which can take months or years as it is. It'd be even more difficult if my dragons became less fertile over time, even if that means less eggs.
It may create a market for young dragons but old dragons will be near worthless for breeding, so that side of the market will crash.
I just see this as beneficial for those who want to apply new genes and sell at a profit. For breeders, it would cause much frustration
Edit: I see you mention cooldowns getting longer, which I missed. This is still frustrating for breeders. My Coatl and WC projects are already time consuming with their month-long cooldown. I can't imagine having to wait longer to breed my pairs.
Hard no, the dragon market doesn't need "fixing"* and why would someone expect to "make money back" from geneing dragons? Genes are for designing dragons you like, not financial investments. Farm fodder if you want money. Don't take away my ability to breed my own dragons; every dragon is going to become "old" if it isn't exalted, and where would that leave dragons whose lore hinges on parenting?
*(and may I point out, I've bought breeding stock for 50kt because that was the cheapest the combo I needed came in, so it's not even that oversaturated)
*(and may I point out, I've bought breeding stock for 50kt because that was the cheapest the combo I needed came in, so it's not even that oversaturated)
Hard no, the dragon market doesn't need "fixing"* and why would someone expect to "make money back" from geneing dragons? Genes are for designing dragons you like, not financial investments. Farm fodder if you want money. Don't take away my ability to breed my own dragons; every dragon is going to become "old" if it isn't exalted, and where would that leave dragons whose lore hinges on parenting?
*(and may I point out, I've bought breeding stock for 50kt because that was the cheapest the combo I needed came in, so it's not even that oversaturated)
*(and may I point out, I've bought breeding stock for 50kt because that was the cheapest the combo I needed came in, so it's not even that oversaturated)
don't like my dragons
[quote name="Rhonu" date="2020-07-12 07:17:27" ]
It is almost impossible to get back the investment to new genes by selling the offspring.
[/quote]
It's not, actually! I tend to make money back from genes by leveling + exalting the offspring I can't sell, but you can still make that money back if you sell low without exalting— it'll just take longer. I've funded multiple genes for breeding projects over the years using the "level + exalt the offspring" strategy and [i]only[/i] counting the offspring of the parents towards that goal.
Expecting to get money back in a certain time period right now is a shot in the dark: some people can do it, especially with newer genes, but some people, especially with older genes, are going to have a harder time. But given a longer time period, [i]everyone[/i] will [i]always[/i] be able to fund genes if they're willing to engage with site mechanics, which I think is ultimately more fair.
For hatcheries in particular, I've heard that there are hatcheries who make a deal with one or several regular exalters to sell their dragons for cheap if they don't sell at the hatchery prices within a certain period of time. I don't know the details myself, but that's one method to keep the prices of your hatchery dragons high while still making dragon cash back if they don't sell. There are definitely ways to have your cake (setting higher prices for offspring) and eat it too (but having a guaranteed small cash flow even if they don't sell) that already exist on the site.
Rhonu wrote on 2020-07-12 07:17:27:
It is almost impossible to get back the investment to new genes by selling the offspring.
It's not, actually! I tend to make money back from genes by leveling + exalting the offspring I can't sell, but you can still make that money back if you sell low without exalting— it'll just take longer. I've funded multiple genes for breeding projects over the years using the "level + exalt the offspring" strategy and only counting the offspring of the parents towards that goal.
Expecting to get money back in a certain time period right now is a shot in the dark: some people can do it, especially with newer genes, but some people, especially with older genes, are going to have a harder time. But given a longer time period, everyone will always be able to fund genes if they're willing to engage with site mechanics, which I think is ultimately more fair.
For hatcheries in particular, I've heard that there are hatcheries who make a deal with one or several regular exalters to sell their dragons for cheap if they don't sell at the hatchery prices within a certain period of time. I don't know the details myself, but that's one method to keep the prices of your hatchery dragons high while still making dragon cash back if they don't sell. There are definitely ways to have your cake (setting higher prices for offspring) and eat it too (but having a guaranteed small cash flow even if they don't sell) that already exist on the site.
From what I read somewhere (hearsay, as I don't think I ever actually saw the developers say this), the dragon market was never meant to be lucrative.
In other words, the dragon market is right where the developers wanted it, where dragons are plentiful and easy to obtain.
There are still 'niche' markets that are more lucrative, but they require either incredible luck, or more effort put into it than simply tossing two dragons together and selling the offspring.
For me, personally, I like that when I joined FR I could get all the dragons I wanted for fairly cheap. They weren't 'perfect' dragons, but I felt like I *could* obtain perfect dragons with just a little more effort. Once I got into the game itself, beyond the 'newbie rush' I realized that perfect was only up to me, and I could be more discriminating on what dragons I bought.
However, if, initially, the only dragons I could afford were older infertile/low fertility ones, that made any sort of breeding difficult if not impossible, I might not have stuck around to get a true feel for the game.
This is a game based around aesthetics, and while it does have a market side to it, dragons are not meant to be that market, as Astariall said, geneing dragons is not lucrative and isn't meant to be, it is meant to help you create a dragon you find pleasing to the eye.
In other words, the dragon market is right where the developers wanted it, where dragons are plentiful and easy to obtain.
There are still 'niche' markets that are more lucrative, but they require either incredible luck, or more effort put into it than simply tossing two dragons together and selling the offspring.
For me, personally, I like that when I joined FR I could get all the dragons I wanted for fairly cheap. They weren't 'perfect' dragons, but I felt like I *could* obtain perfect dragons with just a little more effort. Once I got into the game itself, beyond the 'newbie rush' I realized that perfect was only up to me, and I could be more discriminating on what dragons I bought.
However, if, initially, the only dragons I could afford were older infertile/low fertility ones, that made any sort of breeding difficult if not impossible, I might not have stuck around to get a true feel for the game.
This is a game based around aesthetics, and while it does have a market side to it, dragons are not meant to be that market, as Astariall said, geneing dragons is not lucrative and isn't meant to be, it is meant to help you create a dragon you find pleasing to the eye.
From what I read somewhere (hearsay, as I don't think I ever actually saw the developers say this), the dragon market was never meant to be lucrative.
In other words, the dragon market is right where the developers wanted it, where dragons are plentiful and easy to obtain.
There are still 'niche' markets that are more lucrative, but they require either incredible luck, or more effort put into it than simply tossing two dragons together and selling the offspring.
For me, personally, I like that when I joined FR I could get all the dragons I wanted for fairly cheap. They weren't 'perfect' dragons, but I felt like I *could* obtain perfect dragons with just a little more effort. Once I got into the game itself, beyond the 'newbie rush' I realized that perfect was only up to me, and I could be more discriminating on what dragons I bought.
However, if, initially, the only dragons I could afford were older infertile/low fertility ones, that made any sort of breeding difficult if not impossible, I might not have stuck around to get a true feel for the game.
This is a game based around aesthetics, and while it does have a market side to it, dragons are not meant to be that market, as Astariall said, geneing dragons is not lucrative and isn't meant to be, it is meant to help you create a dragon you find pleasing to the eye.
In other words, the dragon market is right where the developers wanted it, where dragons are plentiful and easy to obtain.
There are still 'niche' markets that are more lucrative, but they require either incredible luck, or more effort put into it than simply tossing two dragons together and selling the offspring.
For me, personally, I like that when I joined FR I could get all the dragons I wanted for fairly cheap. They weren't 'perfect' dragons, but I felt like I *could* obtain perfect dragons with just a little more effort. Once I got into the game itself, beyond the 'newbie rush' I realized that perfect was only up to me, and I could be more discriminating on what dragons I bought.
However, if, initially, the only dragons I could afford were older infertile/low fertility ones, that made any sort of breeding difficult if not impossible, I might not have stuck around to get a true feel for the game.
This is a game based around aesthetics, and while it does have a market side to it, dragons are not meant to be that market, as Astariall said, geneing dragons is not lucrative and isn't meant to be, it is meant to help you create a dragon you find pleasing to the eye.
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Well, there are different ways to play this game. I personally liked the old way very much. I played at the Fairgrounds to get enough money to get the newest genes, then I bred and sold the offspring. I cannot do that any more.
I can put two totally random dergs on the nest and get the same amount of money for the offspring than from hatchlings with a set of newest genes and good, matching colours (after the first month or so after those genes were introduced). Where is the logic in that?
Playing at the Fairgrounds is dull, the Coli is even more dull. So I guess it is time for my final sales and go to some other game. But if you others like the game as it is, good for you.
I can put two totally random dergs on the nest and get the same amount of money for the offspring than from hatchlings with a set of newest genes and good, matching colours (after the first month or so after those genes were introduced). Where is the logic in that?
Playing at the Fairgrounds is dull, the Coli is even more dull. So I guess it is time for my final sales and go to some other game. But if you others like the game as it is, good for you.
Well, there are different ways to play this game. I personally liked the old way very much. I played at the Fairgrounds to get enough money to get the newest genes, then I bred and sold the offspring. I cannot do that any more.
I can put two totally random dergs on the nest and get the same amount of money for the offspring than from hatchlings with a set of newest genes and good, matching colours (after the first month or so after those genes were introduced). Where is the logic in that?
Playing at the Fairgrounds is dull, the Coli is even more dull. So I guess it is time for my final sales and go to some other game. But if you others like the game as it is, good for you.
I can put two totally random dergs on the nest and get the same amount of money for the offspring than from hatchlings with a set of newest genes and good, matching colours (after the first month or so after those genes were introduced). Where is the logic in that?
Playing at the Fairgrounds is dull, the Coli is even more dull. So I guess it is time for my final sales and go to some other game. But if you others like the game as it is, good for you.
[quote]There are still 'niche' markets that are more lucrative, but they require either incredible luck, or more effort put into it than simply tossing two dragons together and selling the offspring.[/quote]
This. You can still sell dragons for large amounts of currency... it's just way more than genes. It's also colors. And that is a real challenge. The offspring of any old two dragons (even with nice colors) aren't worth the same as a dragon designed to have really appealing colors and genes.
And selling/flipping/training fodder dragons is also really lucrative.
Quote:
There are still 'niche' markets that are more lucrative, but they require either incredible luck, or more effort put into it than simply tossing two dragons together and selling the offspring.
And selling/flipping/training fodder dragons is also really lucrative.
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Buying scrolls to gene pairs hasn't been massively profitable since 2013 outside of brand new releases.
Scrolls are a way to get new genes into the game, they aren't really meant to be thrown on every random pair and while you can play the game however you'd like, you can't really expect things to be changed to fit your niche playstyle.
We don't like the idea of being punished just for having old dragons :c Why should our pairs produce fewer offspring just because we've had them for longer?
It would also make it harder and more stressful to make back the money you spent on scrolls if you had a time limit to do so.
Scrolls are a way to get new genes into the game, they aren't really meant to be thrown on every random pair and while you can play the game however you'd like, you can't really expect things to be changed to fit your niche playstyle.
We don't like the idea of being punished just for having old dragons :c Why should our pairs produce fewer offspring just because we've had them for longer?
It would also make it harder and more stressful to make back the money you spent on scrolls if you had a time limit to do so.
Buying scrolls to gene pairs hasn't been massively profitable since 2013 outside of brand new releases.
Scrolls are a way to get new genes into the game, they aren't really meant to be thrown on every random pair and while you can play the game however you'd like, you can't really expect things to be changed to fit your niche playstyle.
We don't like the idea of being punished just for having old dragons :c Why should our pairs produce fewer offspring just because we've had them for longer?
It would also make it harder and more stressful to make back the money you spent on scrolls if you had a time limit to do so.
Scrolls are a way to get new genes into the game, they aren't really meant to be thrown on every random pair and while you can play the game however you'd like, you can't really expect things to be changed to fit your niche playstyle.
We don't like the idea of being punished just for having old dragons :c Why should our pairs produce fewer offspring just because we've had them for longer?
It would also make it harder and more stressful to make back the money you spent on scrolls if you had a time limit to do so.
